aw, for goodness sake - there's bombers/terrorists about!

[Hadrians hiring!]

Remeber seeing a prog a while ago with right wing nuts wanting the Muslims to get fired in about the jews as it would end in a holocost thus ensuing the end of the world and the return of christ. Mad buggers religeous fruitcakes of all persuasions.

[mary,queen of everything]

Hey sweltered, I was once asked what we did for thanksgiving in Scotland,I explained we did nothing, this (highly educated) person did not believe me and kept at me about it until I concocted a story involving oven building, catching and cleaning the wild Scottish ostrich and the recipies for the leftovers. I think to this day that she still thinks there is ostrich running wild in Scotland. The story got quite involved.

[dedalus]

Dedalus, I don't think faith based schools should be abolished. They have every right to practice their religion as anyone else. If they don't want their children going to a faith based school, then don't send them, or better pay for private schooling, it is that simple.

And, by the way, I do rather favour the flying spaghetti monster myself!

Sorry to point out that children have no faith when they are born - they have to be taught faith - where are the rights of children to not be brainwashed. If it wasnt called religion it would be called abuse. Religeous people can never reconcile the fact thier faith cannot be absolute since it is governed by geography. If Ian Paisley had been raised in the Saudi Arabia he would be a Muslim. He wouldnt miraculously be turn out a protestant.

Time we started a campaign to have the flying spaghetti monster ( may he touch you with his noodly frond) taught in RE - just as believable as any other religeous nonsense.

[Sweltered]

Be careful when talking of the Flying Spaghetti Monster ( may he touch you with His Noodly Appendage) in such a trivial manner. He may smite you with his holy balls of meat.

[dedalus]

I trust you are wearing the proper pirate attire when spreading his wheat snack based holy word?

[Bobbie En Tejas]

An atheist is just as adamant about what they believe (and sometimes shoves it down the throat as much) as is a fundamental christian, muslim or anything else, all of which is their belief on spiritual matters. Why can't people just say "I think it might be like this." Like anyone here knows and understands the whole universe and existence enough to say adamantly without a doubt what is or isn't past this.

And Annie, what I meant was, they can call it religious wars all they want, but it is politics. Religion is supposed to be about god and the hereafter. Politics is about authority and power on earth. As they say, if it quacks like a duck....

[dedalus]

An atheist is just as adamant about what they believe (and sometimes shoves it down the throat as much) as is a fundamental christian, muslim or anything else, all of which is their belief on spiritual matters. Why can't people just say "I think it might be like this." Like anyone here knows and understands the whole universe and existence enough to say adamantly without a doubt what is or isn't past this.

And Annie, what I meant was, they can call it religious wars all they want, but it is politics. Religion is supposed to be about god and the hereafter. Politics is about authority and power on earth. As they say, if it quacks like a duck....

au contraire boaby

atheist means ( quite literaly mate) without theism - An atheist will only propound what on the face of all evidence is likely to be true - we cannot tell you what the truth is - just that on the face of the evidence there is no supernatural - the world is considerably older than 4000 years - and the bible ( and the koran) was written by a bronze age, uneducated people, often hundreds of years in arrears of any factual event contained therin, and then badly translated into modern day English - before being hyjacked by various uneducated(by todays standards) organisations with an axe to grind over the years.

other than that believe what you like ( within that context obviously)

unfortunately this bit is omitted from RE as is the aforementioned FSM ( may he touch you with his noodly frond).
Unless RE teaches that God is at best highly unlikely - they are just lying to our children.

[Annie]

I'm staying out of this one!

Long live the flying spaghetti monster!!!

Pastafarianism Rules!

http://www.venganza.org/

[Bobbie En Tejas]

Atheism: the doctrine or belief that there is no God.

It is your belief in spiritual matters. I would assume you have thought long and hard about what you believe, and you believe there is no god. It is your understanding of what is or isn't out there, your conclusion. I stand by what I said. Atheists are as adamant and obnoxious about their belief there is no god as fundamentalists are about their belief there is and they know exactly what it is.

Actually, the bible doesn't say the earth is 4000 years old (that would take it to 2000 bc). Some people believe it says that people have been here for 6000 years. A mathematician should be able to divide up the population enough to see when the first inhabitants of people as we know them were probably here.

The existance of god does not depend on what people believe. What is, is.. regardless of who believes it. He could be a two-headed glow worm, but if he is, he will be that whether we can fathom that or not.

[Sweltered]

Here's something very spooky. I've just looked at the website, and saw the picture. I made my comment about Flying Spaghetti Monster ( may he touch you with His Noodly Appendage), and the balls of meat BEFORE I saw the picture!. I was giving Dedalus too much credit, I thought he'd made it up! Then when I saw the picture.....WOW!.

Second time this week I've had a wee psychic episode.

[dedalus]

wow - I think that qualifies you as a prophet - better get measured up for that pirate outfit.

the best part of pastafarianism - is talk like a pirate day!

[Sweltered]

We can't wait for September the 19th. Bought the the Gospel of the FSM over the weekend, and castigated the guy in Barnes & Noble for having it in the Humour section and not the spirituality section Wife reading it at the moment and thoroughly enjoying it, particularly the "Rather you didn'ts"

[dedalus]

wtf are you doing up at this time?

[general jack o'niell]

may well have been speaking to me!!!! no, that was 11am his time, it was morning before we were talking at 5am jebtime(i know know!!!! but it wouldn't be funny otherwise)

rubin has a fascinating ruler, and sweltered's tooth fairy only gave mima $2 for her first tooth, in quarters so it looked like more!!!! miserable toothfairy

plus sweltered has a new tattoo(how old are you? midlife crisis a little early isn't it? does that mean i'll get something ridiculous tattoed on my head when i'm 50?) and he had no idea what "bingo wings" were when he was showing the tattoo to me on cam (that could sound so wrong, in so many ways, not a spiritual moment i assure you)

just to stay on track, tho it's out of character for me to pretend to even half follow a thread.

i am a confirmed athiest, there is no god cept me, i am my own god, nobody elses, just mine, i don't try to convert anyone, preach(aye that'll be right!) or persuade, i just am. i will be till i die, then i won't, end of.

you believe what you want, i'll not believe any of it, every man woman or child is their own god, saviour, redeemer, free, within reason due to constraints of upbringing, financial situation, mischance of nationality or place of birth, oh or guilt, to live their life as they see fit. to be the best person they can be, to themselves and all around them. you are born, you live, you die, thats it.

i saw in the paper something that i've commented on many times, when ever a sportsperson or a celeb or actor wins anything it is common nowadays to thank either god or jeebus, because we all know that what with floods, earthquakes, tsunami, iraq, afghanistan, the palestine affair, children getting kidnapped in nigeria, little maddie two months on, that god has a keen interest in who wins wimbledon, or the US open, the latest grand prix or the BAFTAS and OSCARS. you know really important things, i expect he is glued to big brother, afterall he, oops, maybe god is a she, or a transexual, or asexual, well god did enjoy britain's got talent so much, probably even voted for that little girl too, shows how much god knows his public?

athiests of the world unite, you've nothing to lose but your? well, you've nothing to lose, way i see it if you don't believe in god, you don't believe in the devil, that doesn't mean you don't believe in good and evil, they are not mutually exclusive, theres no copyright on evil with diablo's name on it. most evil is carried out in the name of some diety or other and yes i include the rise of HIV and AIDS in africa due to the catholic church opposing contraception and abortion as one of the great evils of our time. shame on you!!! oh but there is no shame, because you are forgiven, convenient for you. from here on in, all you athiests, if you do something you shouldn't, forgive yourself, you are your own god, so its only reasonable to cut out the middle man.

oh, just in case i die before most of you? might happen, you never know, anyway, when i die, if theres a service in a church? thats not for me, thats for others in my family, we practice freedom of religion in my house, just because i don't believe doesn't mean everybody else can't, and if they are praying for me? well!!! it won't be the first time i've been wrong about something!!!!

[Sheik Yir Erse]

If Ian Paisley had been raised in the Saudi Arabia he would be a Muslim. He wouldnt miraculously be turn out a protestant.

Dedalus - this is a very valid point, however my honest opinion is that it is not governed solely by geography, it is primarily governed by parentage. Even if Ian Paisley had been born in Riyadh, but was the son of Protestants - the chances are he would still have been a raised Protestant! In your analogy the parents are the ones inflicting the abuse.

I concur 100% with what you are saying - just disagree slightly with the reasoning