Carol Thatcher

[LANDROVER ROGER]

I think that I had better book myself in to The Home For the Perpetually Confused.Cheers Ionnsaigh.

[Ags]

I caught the end of the Jeremy Vine programme today where there was quite a heated debate going on about whether Carol Thatcher shouldn't appear on the bbc again/whether she should apologise/what a waste of space Adrian Chiles is to have complained about her etc etc . One caller came on and described herself as a "black female". Her daughter's favourite toy is a golliwog which she has had since she was a year old. What upsets her (the caller) in all of this isn't Carol Thatcher making a comment in private but Adrian Chiles as a "middle class white man" feeling he has to defend her and make a complaint causing such an uproar in her defence!!

[ionnsaigh]

I think EMDEE hit the nail squarely on the head. Why should someone make a public apology, for a private statement. Now here's me trying to figure out why. Perhaps if that someone, owing to the very nature of the job - has to mix socially.
In other words, was it between the hours of 9 to 5?. Was she under contractual obligations and pay during the conversation?
If she was, then she should apologies in public - afteral it's the public - who are paying her wages.

[ionnsaigh]

Ags - It's not only blacks - who find it offensive.

[gizmo]

Sorry bill, only attempting to be polite - I should have written - right wing conservative shite.

[Martin]

Ags - It's not only blacks - who find it offensive.

The thing is, on Jeremy Vine's prog it was a (black) woman saying how offensive she found white middle class finding the whole Golliwog saga offensive.
Go on then, tell me how a black woman doesn't find it offensive and yet you can. Do you not find it offensive that whites find something offensive that they know nothing about ? Do you not find it offensive that white people think that the black people need a white person to stick up for them ? Do you not find it offensive that what was essentially a private conversation has been moved into the public domain ? Do you not find it offensive that this is a further erosion of our freedom of speech ?
I'm bored today with being snowed in so I'm waiting, quivering in anticipation of your response.....

[gizmo]

I believe the player Maggies daughter was referring to was Gael Monfils. Has anyone seen any of the action photos of this man then maybe instead of being offended people would realise it is actually quite descriptive. I agree with Martin (never thought I would say that ) people jumping on the racist bandwagon at every oportunity is starting to bore the watsits off of me. The use of a word doesnt make you a racist, how you use it may be an indicator.

[LANDROVER ROGER]

Is Gael Monfils gaelic for gollywog?

[Bobbie En Tejas]

Sorry bill, only attempting to be polite - I should have written - right wing conservative shite.

It is near impossible to understand you Ionns when you write what you mean,so understand my difficulty when you write what you don't mean.

See you have me confused now

Bill, now THAT made me laugh!

Personally, I hate derogatory terms for people based on things outside their control, but I hate more invasion of privacy, and if it was said in private it was meant to be kept there. On the other hand, there is a saying, "know your audience." If you wouldn't trust them with your money or your life and you are a public figure, probably best to keep personal thoughts to yourself.

Martin, I hope that the minstrels aren't considered un-PC.. if it is un-PC to depict black minstrels, it must be un-PC to depict white musicians, or mexican mariachis.

[ionnsaigh]

a (black) woman saying how offensive she found white middle class finding the whole Golliwog saga offensive.
Go on then, tell me how a black woman doesn't find it offensive and yet you can.

Interesting to note that she never found the golliwog offensive - she found the white middle class - finding the golliwog offensive - offensive. Clearly a black racist.

Do you not find it offensive that whites find something offensive that they know nothing about ?

Do you honestly think that white people don't suffer from racism? Your post infers that only black people are victims. Get yourself over to some parts of Africa or the Bronx. There you will encounter racism however unlike - as your post implies, you will find good decent black and white people in these places too.

Do you not find it offensive that what was essentially a private conversation has been moved into the public domain ?

That one is up for debate Martin.

Do you not find it offensive that this is a further erosion of our freedom of speech ?

Freedom of speech quite clearly, comes with responsibility of speech. In other words - if I was to call you a wee orange bastard - then claim the right to freedom of speech - I would be in violation of this freedom.

[Martin]

Interesting to note that she never found the golliwog offensive - she found the white middle class - finding the golliwog offensive - offensive. Clearly a black racist.

A Black Racist ???? Oh FFS, who are we calling racist now ? My head is whirling and what's left of my brain is confused. I thought it was quite clear....that most right thinking, amiable black folk can take a joke, see things for what they are and don't get too upset. Problem solved.
The lady on Jeremy Vine refferded to her Afro hairdo in the seventies and could see the similarities between her own hair style and a Golliwog (I think that's what she said).
I used to live in one of the most multi-cultural towns in England and name calling was a part of things, it was accepted from both white and black to black and white. It's how it's said that counts, the whole context of it and it takes a mean spirited, pick holes in anything, Politically Correct creature to read into things something that isn't there.
Just my thoughts.

Freedom of speech quite clearly, comes with responsibility of speech. In other words - if I was to call you a wee orange bastard - then claim the right to freedom of speech - I would be in violation of this freedom.

Nah, my wee chest would puff out with pride, thanks for the compliment.

[Tosh]

The BBC has said it was not a private conversation and it was said in front of at least 12 people.

[Martin]

Must have been 12 very disturbed and bored people then. Anyway, 12 people is hardly public, is it ?

[LANDROVER ROGER]

Must have been 12 very disturbed and bored people then. Anyway, 12 people is hardly public, is it ?

12 People?The jury is out on that one.

[Tosh]

Must have been 12 very disturbed and bored people then. Anyway, 12 people is hardly public, is it ?

Its hardly private and the reports contradict Thatch Jnr.'s claim that it was said in jest.